I would just call the credit card company and ask them to cancel it, and say that you were not able to get any help from Microsoft customer service, and that you want to cancel all the accounts associated with the card. Put it in writing if you have to and send it to the credit card company. Then start fresh using a different credit card for each service, but not one card for all of them. Maybe a different live id for each service as well.

And here I was kinda on the fence about whether to get a PS3 or Xbox 360 when/if I ever decide to get a next gen console. I have to admit that your post just put another point on the PS3 side. I do hope you manage to get this resolved somehow, and soon.

Well, you were the one that bragged on how Microsoft was going sync everything together, xbox360, zune, windows mobile, the Windows Pc, Azure, Microsoft Bob, and now you Billing. How do you feel about it now is the question?

Look like they done a great job of syncing your credit card.

Joe you are a jackass.. You do something completely Stupid and expect MS to fix something there is already a process in place to allow you to fix by yourself. So your stupidity doesn't constitute a MS problem or urgency to fix.

How about you just call this so called friend and have them change it on their box. It tells me that you are doing something else fishing and are telling us a half truth story here.

Then just spend the $50 bucks you cheap ass and by another gold subscription.

Joe, you must be a pretty good dad. To have a daughter with a heart to be looking to help others who might not be so fortunate reflects well on the parents. imo

To "Joe you are a moron"...

Joe did not do anything out of the ordinary, he made a simple mistake which plenty of far less technically savvy people will make. The system has to cope with millions of individuals with vastly different levels of technical ability and understanding.

Looks like there is a serious problem with how all this hangs together in the back end together with not equipping the customer service people with the correct tools to manage it all - a disaster waiting to happen.

Joe, Just get this article spread on eweek etc and I am sure someone at Microsoft will fix it for you (unless 'Joe you are a moron' is MS support).

I am always amazed by how much abuse and money XBox users are prepared to go through. I prefer Sony's approach here, make a box that will last 10 years and make the online experience free to encourage as much use as possible. When you lose your money, you are called a tight ass for not spending another $50 per year... Yet XBox is marketed for tight asses. Classic.

Something about eggs and baskets comes to mind here, that's why I advocate open protocols to communicate between independent entities. Much like HTML and the web has worked so well over the years. Just be thankful it is not linked to your Windows login or live backup (yet).

Joe Says:
"Whoops. I should have been able to use the Xbox 360 to re-associate the gamertag with the old Live ID. But the process repeatedly failed with an error message."
----------------------------------------------------
And here we get to the heart of the matter. The software, as I read what you are saying, is supposed to allow this option, but won't when you try it? As in more broken software from Microsoft, or is it that MS just wanted you to think you had that freedom or choice of option, but really did not?

I say use stop payment and call the credit card company as another user suggested. The fact that you will lose Onecare is no great loss at all. Replace it with the far better and free AVG, you be glad you did.

@Joe you are a Moron :
I don't think Joe is a Moron, but even he admits to making an mistake. The only thing I could say, is Joe, if this XBox360 you are giving away was not a "free" demo machine provided by Micro$oft, after all the links and posts that I put up on your site about the failure rate, hardware problems, and scratched disks, then maybe, well lets just say you are that extreme MS Fanboy I that even I thought you not.

Mind that most people are just going go out and buy a console and have not read about all the hardware problems of the XBox360, but you Joe, should know better. That is unless it was given to you by MS. Again, I am not saying other than the hardware problems that the XBox360 does not have good games or anything, only that its a badly hardware engineered product. My choice if I was to buy one would be an old PS2.

Should Microsoft be able to fix your billing problem? Absolutely. Is it all their problem, no. You did admit to making the mistake, even so MS needs to get things right, especially billing.

Joe;

You are not a moron. Again, like others have said, many people will and have made the same mistake or problem.

I have a old Microsoft XBox that is still working fine, the old black box. My grandaughters that come over eventually forced me to upgrade. I did, I went with the Sony Playstation 3 with all the bells and whistles on it. My son went through 3 360's in the time I owned, and still do, my SPS-3.

For fun, I am gonna hack my old xbox and make it into a "toy" file server or something useful. Any ideas?

Draoi Dubh wrote: "Joe; You are not a moron."

I've heard that before.

What's moronic: That moving a gamertag would also move all the other Microsoft service accounts linked to the original Live ID associated with those services. That's the point here. I would have given up the gamertag. My mistake. My penalty for it. But the reassociation of all accounts linked to the Live ID changes everything. Windows Live OneCare was associated to a Live ID, not a gamertag.

Joe

Sure you made a mistake Joe, but why are you suffering like that for it? This sounds to me like another example of the enforced MS hive mentality. "Oh, but you *must* do like this and never like that - it's all your fault we're screwing you over because you don't conform to our mistaken ideas about how things should go."

Joe;

Excellent point... Microsoft boasts about the "Passport Live ID" thing, sound really great, I mean I have everything to do with my dealing done on this account and premise, and now I am seeing through your experience, that it just is not so with Redmond.

Right, the gamertag shouldn't have "jack s--t" to do with your Live ID in any other Live ID based application. I think, what little I know, the authentication and authorization processes with anyone's Live ID should not be predicated on a gamertag of any kind, that is, if you catch my drift.

Joe says:
"I really wanted to keep the gamertag, joewilcox, because of Zune and possibility of buying another Xbox console someday."
----------------------------------------------------
Question: Do you still want to buy another XBox360 someday Joe? Even will all the hardware problems the 360 has had? Even with this billing problem you have now?

Its being reported in MicroMart, that PS3 sales have now overtaken 360. Sorry MS, if thats to be believed it looks like another product range where you are at the bottom of the pile.
-
A shame really, as I never had any issues with mine, and before replacing it under the TV with a WII for the kids, I was reasonably happy with it.
-
What people dont mention is the whole scheme that MS runs when offering online play.
-
Just look at your PC for a second, you could go out and buy the latest game e.g COD and be playing online for free in minutes. Theres plenty of free servers out there, and loads of fun to be had.
-
Then you look at 360. You have to have a internet provider, and then you pay again just so that you can play your games online. Theres no choice about going to a free server, you either do it the MS way or not at all. First point.
-
Fancy writing software for the 360? Fancy distributing your work to people? Isnt that something which made computing what it is today and that tradition continues with projects such as MAME? Well, unless Im mistaken, if you want to deploy your 360 work, youre going to have to pay for that too. (please someone correct me there if im wrong)
-
To me, this is the best example of what a MS world would look like. You cant blame them, they are a company who wants to make money, but then you look at the latest patent they are applying for and realize that MS loves this PPV idea. So maybe in a MS future, under your stairs, you'll have a electric meter, a gas meter, a water meter and a Microsoft meter. What a wonderful future we can all look forward to.
-
Maybe people want this, since few seem bothered that after a purchase of a system, the sucking of customers money goes on without end (IMO)

I'm surprised at how there are so many technologically smart people here but so few can understand the importance of VCSY's patents.

Because SharePoint is providing a goldmine for Microsoft partners, it should also provide a goldmine to VCSY.

VCSY threw Sharepoint into the lawsuit a month before the July 10th scheduled Markman Hearing and then Microsoft asked for a two week extension as the brought in a settlement expert.
So I think it's safe to assume that VCSY is getting royalties from SharePoint.
At this time I see VCSY's stock as being well under valued and that's only because of the concentrated effort to con VCSY shareholders out of their shares, but once the royalties start showing up I believe that VCSY's shareprice will go from 2 cents to twenty dollars and more pretty quickly.

http://www.devx.com/MS_Partner/Article/39761
SharePoint Proving a Goldmine for Microsoft Partners
About 80 percent of businesses are expected to be using SharePoint by 2010, according to Gartner. That means for the Microsoft channel community, SharePoint is a potential goldmine, a repeat revenue generator, and customer relationship builder – if you get it right.
by Lynn Haber
November 4, 2008

The release of Microsoft Office SharePoint Server (MOSS) 2007 two years ago has been nothing less than mesmerizing. Surpassing sales of $1 billion dollars and 100 million licenses this year, the market reception for SharePoint has even exceeded the vendor's expectations. For the Microsoft channel community, SharePoint is a potential goldmine, a repeat revenue generator and customer relationship builder – if you get it right.
About 80 percent of businesses are expected to be using SharePoint by 2010, according to Gartner, which means big business potential for the channel. For those channel partners looking to build a successful SharePoint practice, it pays to heed the advice of SharePoint experts with several years of experience under their belts.
Start Small
What's very quickly becoming obvious about SharePoint 2007 is its potential not as a packaged product but as a platform for collaboration, portals, enterprise search, enterprise content management, business processes and forms, and business intelligence. That's a lot of opportunity for solution providers to optimize SharePoint for their customers. At the same time, the breadth of SharePoint capability creates a potential pitfall for partners who jump in too soon and try to be all things to all customers.
Define your competency, says Bob Anderson, vice president of research, SMB business at Gartner.
"For resellers, partners, and consultants, SharePoint is the brass ring, but at the same time it can also be the noose falling over their heads if they don't have a competency before hanging out a shingle," Anderson says.
Solution providers who promote themselves as SharePoint generalists are likely to get in over their heads. Think of SharePoint as a toolkit – then pick one tool to get started. For example, the portal tool for integrating applications over the Web; the collaboration tool for interacting with suppliers or customers; for business intelligence using dashboards, Web parts, scorecards, key performance indicators (KPIs); the enterprise search tool for scanning all content and looking at both structured and unstructured data.
"The objective is to meet the business needs of your clients. Walk before you run," says Anderson.
Gold Certified Microsoft channel partner Turnberry Solutions Inc., in Blue Bell, Penn., has been working with SharePoint for a couple of years. Brett Stoutland, senior account manager, refers to the company as students of the game.
"What we've been leaning towards doing with SharePoint is specializing in one or two areas of SharePoint, packaging it up and offering it to our customer base," he says, noting that the company is strong in three vertical markets: telecom, pharmaceuticals, and financial services.
The result? Better customer satisfaction when you're able to identify the customers business need and match it to solution provider's expertise.
Plan for Success
That's what Microsoft Gold Certified partner ThinkNet did when they made a strategic business decision about four years ago to spin off SharePointHQ, a separate company, based in Toronto. SharePointHQ offers training, professional services, Web parts, hosting and custom development solutions for SharePoint products and technologies.
"At that time we recognized that SharePoint made things easier for our clients and they liked it," says Hans Leuschner, chief architect at SharePointHQ.
But the SharePoint specialists recognized something else going on in the market, as well – many poor SharePoint deployments.
"We've seen and fixed a lot of SharePoint implementations that clearly showed a lack of knowledge or expertise," he says, while also noting accompanying customer disappointment.
To avoid poor results, he recommends training and learning. In fact, all of the company's consultants go through SharePointHQ's courseware on SharePoint 2007.
Certainly becoming a Microsoft Certified Technology Specialist in SharePoint 2007 is a no brainer. It's also important to note that in spring 2009, Microsoft will roll out its Microsoft Certified Master: SharePoint Server 2007 certification.
Then there's learning by doing.
Recognizing MOSS as a large business opportunity, Microsoft Gold Certified partner Heartland Technology Group's strategy is to promote SharePoint to customers by using it internally. "Using the technology in-house we can translate that usage into a strategy with our clients," says Jane Cage, chief operating officer with Heartland Technology Joplin, Mo.
Today, the solution provider has more than half a dozen SharePoint subnets from its main SharePoint portal site. For example, there's a human resource site for employee information; a discussion group for engineers to share ideas and problem solve; a site where sales staff and engineer can work together to scope projects; and a place to track Market Development Funds.
"The more we use it internally, the more we're able to listen to our clients and understand how we can apply it to meet their business needs," says Cage, noting that how to best explain SharePoint capabilities to a customer and match a client's needs to the product's vast range of capabilities, isn't apparent by simply viewing SharePoint out of the box.
Thinknet's Leuschner also points out that without proper training and a clear understanding of SharePoint, it's easy to install it and look successful. "But if you don't know the details behind the technology and think through an implementation ahead of time, you'll run into walls when you try to scale it," he says.
That's not a place solution providers want to be based on an IDC Microsoft SharePoint Server Ecosystem and Customer Usage Trends Survey published in July of 2007. According to the study, MOSS is expanding its footprint in the enterprise with organizations planning to add more users and integrate more enterprise data sources into their SharePoint environment.
"There's more evidence that companies are increasing their SharePoint footprint within the enterprise," says Kathleen Quirk, research manager for enterprise portal at IDC.
The take away: specialize, create small wins, refine, reiterate, and expand to other areas of the enterprise. If you make SharePoint easy to use, users will like using it and will want to apply it elsewhere.
Hire a Practice Director
Thinknet looked at the SharePoint opportunity and launched a SharePoint business. Turnberry Solutions recognized that building a successful SharePoint practice required making an investment in hiring a SharePoint Practice Manager.
"Without one, everyone is doing SharePoint on the side," says Stoutland.
What does it take to be a SharePoint Practice Manager? At Turnberry that would be a SharePoint professional who is strong on both the technology side and business side. "The manager also has to be familiar with the Microsoft Partner Network and understand the Microsoft ecosystem," he says.
Today, SharePoint represents about 10 percent of Turnberry's revenue. The company wants to triple that figure in about eight months. With a SharePoint Practice Manager at the helm, the company can have controlled growth, taking risks but not selling more than it can produce given internal resources.
Utilize Microsoft Partner Tools
Devoting significant resources to help its channel partners launch successful SharePoint practices, savvy partners are taking advantage of Microsoft's investments.
In addition to a plethora of Web-based resources for channel partners, Microsoft launched the SharePoint Deployment Planning Services (SDPS) a partner-delivered offering, and Software Assurance benefit, designed to help customers successfully plan their deployment of SharePoint.
Participation in SDPS requires certification. Partners with Microsoft competencies in Information Worker Portals and Collaboration, Enterprise Content Management, or Search specialization qualify to become certified in SDPS. Certified SDPS partners get access to new knowledge offerings such as SharePoint Deployment Plan Templates, Architecture Design Guidance Documents, and SharePoint server farm deployment guidance, according to the company.
Microsoft also offers resources through the MSDN SharePoint Developer Center and Micosoft.com Training site.
Microsoft partners also report that they look for opportunities using partner program leads, share experiences via Microsoft user groups, and make sure to get themselves in front of their Microsoft Partner Area Manager (PAM).
"If we can find out where SharePoint is selling, that's a big nugget," says Stoutland.
SharePoint is an iterative thing. "Begin with one project for the client then go on to phase two, then three, etc.," says Leuschner, noting that it's up to the solution provider to help the client to understand all the features of SharePoint.
Follow that advice and you're likely to have a client for a long time along with refferals

A huge Sharepoint ad posted in the middle of a thread about the Xbox 360 and its related online services...

And people were here complaining about the so-called "Linux spam"? (which was usually nothing more than a presentation of a alternate viewpoint relevant to the debate in the thread)

it funny that there is one rule for one and one for the other. I hope people notice how I havent commented on the new thread about experiences with win 7. This is due to the fact that i havent used it and believe that the coments should be there for people that have.
-
People often accuse me of being an ms hater and a Linux activist, this could not be further from the truth and I think our shill posters may have finally worked out why the majority of Linux and open source users post here. (hence why Andre seems reluctant to return and clear up the pdc matter)
-
For me posting here is a battle. Not a battle to get Linux the market share that Windows has (ive said before I believe mass migration to the platform would result in an OS like Vista) its not a battle to see Microsoft bankrupt, nor is it a battle to cheapen everything ms does. The battle here is simply one of integrity. Its one where fraudulant claims, false facts and underhanded tactics are challenged. For me I post here in order so that the shill types cant put accross their opinions as facts, and it is to hopefully at least make people who didnt know, they have a choice and go off and research themselves. If at the end of that research they decide to stay with ms then fine, but at least they made an informed decision.
-
I believe that MS sees the Linux supporters as a threat, we post here for no reason other than enthusiasm and honest held belief about our computing experiences.
-
Back on subject, what I will say in favor of MS and the 360 faults was that from reading others experiences on the net, the customer service in relation to these faults was excellent. Great news for the end user (and thats the people i care about) not so great for people who have MS stock (imo) and as weve seen MS are alleged to have made very little if any profit on the system, which has lost the battle to Nintendo, and if reports are true, has also slipped behind ps3.

"MS are alleged to have made very little if any profit on the system"

Its not alleged AFAIK, they have spent somewhere around 20bn and generated maybe 500m in revenue. That's a massive loss from where I am standing.

There are 2 groups of people though, one thinks, like me, that the XBox is not profitable. The other group says they are profitable because the E&D division reported a profit last time and the 15bn should just be ignored as a sunk cost. The problem is that E&D includes more than just XBox (it also includes Mac software and hardware like mice and keyboards, which are known to be profitable in their own right).

XBox will probably never make a profit on its original investment. It was more a strategical move to block Sony from the living room. We won't know if it worked for another 5-10 years though.

http://www.micromartltd.co.uk/gpage.html

We can now add failing video chips in addition to the RROD problem. I can't see any XBoxs being around in 10 years so Sony is probably safe.

@Billybob
Quote "Its not alleged AFAIK, they have spent somewhere around 20bn and generated maybe 500m in revenue. That's a massive loss from where I am standing."
-
LOL. Thats my typing style im affraid. I tend to put "IMO" or "it is alleged", when typing about facts that I havent actually seen myself. The other reason I do it is because Im very aware that there are individuals who will twist my words in order to fit their viewpoint, AND I wouldnt like to give MS any ammunition for a legal challenge!! as Im sure they would if they believed they could prove a case.
-
Quote "We can now add failing video chips in addition to the RROD problem. I can't see any XBoxs being around in 10 years so Sony is probably safe."
-
Completely agree, and I think whilst jumping on the console bandwagon MS was blissfully unaware that it could harm their PC market. Afterall, if young "johnny" plays all his games on an Xbox, what incentive is there to keep up to date with Windows flagship product Windows (when it already does the other side of his home needs perfectly i.e surfing/wordprocessing)
-
I personally think the Xbox is the best of the three (not so much on specs, but I refuse to be sucked into the PS3/Xbox battle!), and I do believe there will be one more Xbox. The big shame is, if MS had, had no issues with the console, and Nintendo hadnt come along with theirs, I think MS would have won this battle, since the Playstation platform (IMO) is such a devil to develop for.

Oh and can I just add, our friend Andre Da Costa has returned on the Windows 7 thread (I wonder if he read I wouldnt post there?) and he's got a link to his review of Windows beta.
-
Unfortunately he hasnt commented on the PDC matter.
-
Come on Andre, did you go to the PDC? Your blog says you didnt however the link below implies you did?
-
and before/if you answer keep in mind I took a screen grab of your blog.
-
http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/microsoft/archives/152854.asp

Something billybob said earlier. He said that xbox was more of a move to block sony from the living room. I think he is correct.
-
Its tragic to see then, that xbox had hardware issues, lost its hdvd war to sonys blueray and now it appears has dropped to third place in the console scene. If billybobs assesment is correct (and as I say I agree with him) then MS didnt seem to consider or plan for the biggest threat coming not from sony but Nintendo.
-
Is this an example of shortsighted MS or is it as Andre would probably put it "another unfortunate incident"
-
I will let others decide.

I too am suffering due to the confusing way xbox live associates gamertags. I am proud to say that I was part of the original beta test for xbox live. I created what I thought was a unique gamertag. It has been my on line name since the day I first used the Internet. Sadly due to some freak accident my account became corrupted and I was told that my gamertag was gone and could never be used again. That freak accident was Windows Live ID. Due to some strange connection between xbox live and windows live and a misspelling of my email my account became corrupted and therefore no longer usable. This however did not prevent xbox live from continuing to send me emails or from sending me bills for my corrupted account. Oddly I was also able to use my gamertag up until the point that I purchased an ELITE360 and tried to transfer everything over. The only thing xbox live was willing to due was cancel the original account and credit me with Microsoft points to re download various maps and other items that I had purchased. While the account cancellation occurred I still have not received the credited points.
I find it difficult to fathom why in this day and age with all of the ability to adjust information that they could not simply repair the account or create a new one with my original Gamertag.
Anyone have any Ideas or help?

tagged out,
Endcat (now Endcat2)

Seems I'm having a similar problem. In January, after years of using XBox Live on my original XBox, I bought a 360. However when I tried to migrate my account I got a message saying that the Windows Live ID I was using was associated with the gamertag. I've searched the net for a solution to this and spoken with XBox customer support on far too many occasions but so fat they have no solution. At least I don't think they have one since I am continually told that my problem is being escalated and that I will get a call back but that has only happened once in the 2 1/2 months that this has been going on and all the rep did at that point was to asked me some of the same questions all the other reps had asked when I called in myself. This could be related to the expiring Windows Live ID issue that has been discussed on several forums since January but so far XBox support won't even comment on that either.

Dear Microsoft, I purchased a Xbox 360. 8 months later it quit working. Im sent it in and they said they fixed it. 4 montths later it did the same thing. Now they want to chaarge me a $100.00 to fix it and I don't think I should have to seeing as the same problem started again. I would like to know how to resolve this problem as because of the econimics going on right now I don't have the extra money. Oh and they asked when I sent it in if I had insurance and I said no because no one told me I could purchase it for $30.00. I would hasve taken it but no one offered it. Please help me get my Xbox fixed so my grandkid s will have it to play again when they come over.I always thought Microsoft made a superior product and this is why I purchased it. I did not think I would have this much trouble with it.
Yours Truly, Dominick Verciglio, Pipe Creek, Texas