Dude, you can't just be negative all the time and think that you can match up with the standard that Mary Jo set.

The company should have used the download blocker instead of a memo, end of story.

"My sister asked me the right question: 'Why is Internet Explorer 7 a critical update?' I'm not certain that it is, simply because I manually installed on my Windows XP machines. I do know that the software is issued through Automatic Update."

Have you been under a rock for the last month?

don't know what version of quickbooks they're using, but i use qbk2k4 with ie 7 and have all through the beta. not one issue. they have some other issues, not quickbooks.

QB2005 simply gives a warning that it is not compatible - but so far I cannot find what is not meant to work, since it works fine with IE7

Your sister's company should fire the I.T. management because of not being aware of major changes in the industry, not planning for basic upgrades like this, and blaming others for their incompetence. I'm not even exagerating. If they can't handle this, what happens when a serious issue hits them in their databases or network?

Hi Joe ... I have Quickbooks 7.4 and IE7 has not done anything wrong mate !
I agree with the other posts, and think that you are "clutching at straws"at being biased yet again against MS. Stop being an MS Basher write some proper articles (not stories, in otherwords fiction) instead.
Why do you keep on doing these sort of articles? We the people that read them wanting to keep up on whats happening, simply see these articles of yours and know that they are biased and sometimes farcical (like your story headed "Search Me" that was a doozy.
I do not like having to do this sort of thing and would much rather just read your articles rather than showing you that we (your readers) actually have brains !

Please note the heading of this article and then treat it as such.... "IE7 Cautionery Tale" the emphasis on Tale, that is why the evidence in this "article" does not stack up !
It is nothing more than a "Tale" a "Story", fiction in otherwords, something to send MAC and Linux users to sleep with !
And anyone who uses a PC and has windows installed look out for Joe Willcox. It seems to me that he is against anything remotely to do with Microsoft (rightly or wrongly).
I just don't understand why he bothers and for that matter where is the person in charge of this site.
Don't let this site go down to tubes, we are NOT atupid even though Joe thinks that he can get away with "stories" like this one, there will ALWAYS be someone who won't be fooled !

You really annoy me Wilcox. Copmanies new for months about IE7:
- giving Quicken PLENTY of time to fix any issues,
- Microsoft told everyone how to stop IE7 from auto downloading (my brothers TAFE even did it),

...another typical bash Microsoft article from Microsoft-Watch...

This may sound flip, but I'm quite serious that it sounds like this company needs a new director of IT.

Internet Explorer is absolutely a critical download. IE has been the source of the majority of Windows security bugs for a while now. Microsoft has, rightly so, decided to reengineer IE from the ground up to fix security. IE 7 has been in beta for OVER 6 months and unless you've been living in a cave, a serious IT department would know how big an upgrade this is.

My company has been testing IE 7 since beta and while we had problems, we have updated all of our divisions except one which will get updated after we figure out a solution to a few ancient apps.

Yes, IE 7 is disruptive, but I'll take that in a second over IE 6.

As a web developer, I have had to put up with IEs quirks and bugs for far too long. While IE7 relieves the pain of trying to create web sites that work in non-standards compliant IE, it is by far the worst browser on the planet, nine years behind web standards of all sorts and unable to perform web operations available on ANY other browser years ago.

The sooner this hack of a program gets eliminated the better. I'm not going to jump on any band wagons and yell "Use Firefox!" but I will say please, please use ANYTHING but IE and maybe this abysmal excuse for a web browser will go away and make our jobs easier.

Gosh Joe, you got the MS fanboys upset with this one! Of course they'd rather not accept the stupidity of MS bolting IE to the OS purely because it helped in their anti-trust trial.

Of course they'd rather not accept that MS pushing IE 7 as a critical update will seriously affect some users, or that Windows Software Update is not anywhere near as simple or foolproof as MS would have you believe.

Some of the comments could be straight from an MS marketing brochure. I'd tell your sister's company to stop using IE altogether and to tell everyone they train not to use it either. Tell them to complain to MS that the browser should be separated from the OS so that it can be removed completely.

You never know, they might start a new business line teaching how to use Mozilla or Opera.

I missed this from Ron G.: No, IE7 is NOT re-engineered from the ground up. It has only 12 bug fixes, security fixes but, other than that, is IE6 in a new wrapper.

lol

Why is IE7 getting the bad rap? One of the most backwards companies is Intuit. They've had PLENTY of time (and that's being generous) to develop, test, and patch anything that needs fixing as a result of IE7, and they didn't do it. This is very typical of Intuit. They're a re-active company, not proactive.

The IT department was incompetent, because they failed to install the IE7 upgrade blocker. Intuit was incompetent, because they failed to change their software during the IE7 beta period. And this is Microsoft's fault?

Brian:
Good question, why is IE7 getting the bad rap?
Microsoft should be getting the bad rap. They're forcing this release too early.

They released IE7 in late November. That version - not a release candidate, not a beta, but the actual final shipping version - is what comapnies were waiting for so that tey could test and patch their products.

Microsoft has given less than two months for that to happen in.

Does that really sound reasonable? Less than two months in which to test, certify and patch your whole software portfolio?

Nobody's going to do it with the beta, by the way. Nobody sane, anyway. After all, when you're doing it with the beta - well, did you find a bug in their product or yours? It's a mug's game. Only small companies that have small portfolios and want to choose to waste their time like that will do anything more than cursory testing with the betas - the real work begins when the final product ships.

Yes, Microsoft should secure IE. No, they shouldn't place an undue burden on the rest of the industry as they do it. They could have managed this much better, but they chose to do it this way. Which makes them either naive or incompetant. I'm not quite sure which it actually is...

Brian:
Good question, why is IE7 getting the bad rap?
Microsoft should be getting the bad rap. They're forcing this release too early.

They released IE7 in late November. That version - not a release candidate, not a beta, but the actual final shipping version - is what companies were waiting for so that they could test and patch their products.

Microsoft has given less than two months for that to happen in.

Does that really sound reasonable? Less than two months in which to test, certify and patch your whole software portfolio?

Nobody's going to do it with the beta, by the way. Nobody sane, anyway. After all, when you're doing it with the beta - well, did you find a bug in their product or yours? It's a mug's game. Only small companies that have small portfolios and want to choose to waste their time like that will do anything more than cursory testing with the betas - the real work begins when the final product ships.

Yes, Microsoft should secure IE. No, they shouldn't place an undue burden on the rest of the industry as they do it. They could have managed this much better, but they chose to do it this way. Which makes them either naive or incompetant. I'm not quite sure which it actually is...

(Apologies for the double-post. The first one seemed to fail, so I hit the back button, corrected a spelling mistke I noticed, and then re-submitted. Only then did I notice I'd produced a duplicate... Sorry!)

I keep automatic updated turned off and blocked by my firewall. I'm always happy I've done so. I've had too many friends have their systems crash after applying a patch from MS.

I question what could be wrong with an application that would break with a browser upgrade. If Microsoft is really doing it's job, there should not be any backwards-compatability problems with a web browser. The web world is bigger than even Microsoft (although there are times I wonder if they realize that), and any web browser should support common constructs that have been traditionally used on the web. I just guess that this the same ole' Microsoft we have all come to know and love (not).

OTOH, maybe Quickbooks is using HTML that is proprietary to IE. Bad mistake. A well-designed application that has a web interface should be designed to work with any browser out there.

I'ts little wonder Firefox is stealing morr and more market share. I say, 'let it happen'!

As a developer, I find it irritating that ClearCase (a CASE tool) stops working after an IE7 install - IE7 seems to be too deeply rummaging in anything network and network share related.

If this is a sign of things to come with Vista, good night Microsoft.

Ron G: ROCK ON! I said that in an earlier post. Life changes, systems change... an I.T. director should be aware of major changes coming and adapt for it.

Perhaps a better title for this Mr. Wilcox, is "I.T. Directors need to do their job".

Nothing drops like an atomic bomb other than an atomic bomb. You use the term in poor taste. Drop the sensational terminology, else we shall deem you a tabloid journalist.

For what it's worth, IE7 is not entirely automatic. It is listed as a Critical Update, and it will download if Automatic Updates is configured, but it will not actually install unless an administrative user specifically approves both the installation and the license agreement.

And there are several ways to stop IE7 from installing even then. One is the referenced blocker program, another is a registry entry, and another is an Active Directory setting.

It can also be uninstalled from Add or Remove Programs; a rollback is not necessary.

But as people have noted here, it seems that any recent version of QuickBooks (2004 or later) will work with IE7 anyway.

Further, since IE7 is, as mentioned here, more than just a browser upgrade, a person who uses Firefox for browsing will still run into problems with these applications if all current critical updates (including IE7) are installed on the computer.

In other words, the obsolete versions of QuickBooks will not work with a fully-patched Windows XP system.

So the question arises, what is a training organization doing "training" people on an obsolete program? Do they also have their spreadsheet class using Lotus 1-2-3 Release 4?

What everyone so far seems to missing is does Joe Wilcox actually have a sister that this situation supposedly happened to ??
I for one doubt it very much, and feel that it is just another way for Joe Wilcox to have a go at Vista/IE7, etc. yet again, rightly or in this case WRONGLY !
Think about the scenario that Joe Wilcox has layed out here and if it were in YOUR work place would it EVER happen, and I would venture to say ...NO it would never happen !
To the people who are criticising Quickbooks or IE7 .... You have been had by Joe Wilcox !!

I fault Intuit for integrating their program so tightly with IE that if their is an upgrade or change it would break their application. How hard is it to write an application that is not depended on a certain version of IE? QuickBooks is Intuits cash cow does the data format really need to change every year? No but little things like the above force upgrades and money in the pockets of Intuit.

What a load of ill-informed, rumored horse hockey! Get the facts: http://msmvps.com/blogs/spywaresucks/archive/2006/07/27/105929.aspx (note the date of Sandi's blog entry, please)

[quote]
"It was listed as a critical update," my sister complained. "Of course, they installed it." ...Assuming critical update is correct, the designation isn't surprising. Microsoft considers IE 7 to be a major Windows security enhancement.
[/quote]

IE7 is a high priority update, NOT a critical update! See: http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/archive/2006/11/13/ie7-worldwide-distribution-by-automatic-updates.aspx

Any IT-specific company, especially one dealing with computer training
(whatever that is) that was not aware of IE7 being offered by Automatic/Windows Update is doing a lousy job of it. This was widely announced months ago, as was the availability of an IE7 Blocker Toolkit: http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/archive/2006/07/26/678149.aspx

[quote]
We are also providing a Blocker Toolkit for our enterprise customers who may want to block automatic delivery of IE7 in their organizations; this blocker has no expiration date. Enterprise customers can download the free Blocker Toolkit from the Microsoft Download Center today. We�ve also made additional information for IT administrators available at the Windows Update/Microsoft Update site on TechNet.
[quote]
Source: http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/archive/2006/07/26/678149.aspx
--
~Robear Dyer (PA Bear)
MS MVP-Windows (IE, OE, Security, Shell/User)

Quickbooks sent an email to clients about IE7 on 23 October - didn't the IT department see it? The original communication is here:

http://recp.proadvisors.intuit.com/servlet/MailView?ms=MzEzNjk4S0&r=MjgwNzU0MTA1NgS2&j=NzExNjA0MDQS1&mt=1

IE7 was in beta for roughly a year - wasn't that enough warning?

Then there is this:
http://www.quickbooks.com/support/ie7

1. Why isn't such a large, international network controlled by something like WSUS?

2. Why does all of their users have local admin rights (a pre-requisite to installing IE7)

3. Two words "blocker tool".

4. Why try to use a Restore Point? Is add/remove programs beyond the abilities of that company's technical support?

By the way, using Restore Points is not recommended when removing IE7 - first because it doesn't work and second because Restore Points don't touch the following IE specific directories:

..\cookies
..\favorites
..\History
..\internetcache
..\Downloaded Program Files
..\Offline Web Pages
..\temp
..\TMP
..\Documents And Settings\All Users\Favorites
..\Documents And Settings\All Users\Documents
..\Documents And Settings\Default User\My Documents
..\Documents And Settings\Default User\Favorites
..\Documents And Settings\Default User\Cookies
..\Documents And Settings\Default User\Cache
..\Documents And Settings\Default User\Local Settings\History
..\Documents And Settings\Default User\Local Settings\Temp
..\Documents And Settings\Default User\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files

I would not trust such a badly run, ill-informed "computer training company" to train my staff.

The IT Department is in sore need of education. Tell your system to pass on a message that the IT department needs to visit the following Web page:

http://www.ie-vista.com

Navigate to the Knowledge Base page.

I agree that it should not have been a critical update. The effect is not just to the IT director, but individual users as well.

Also it should be understood that all IT directors may not believe that locking the desktop down is the best way to manage a group. Freedom of users to configure their own machines is a good thing in many businesses. Within reason of course. In this case it caused a major mishap which is a risk when users are given some freedom.

I think MS missed the boat on calling IE7 a critical update. It was not. Critical updates are things that MS does not want questioned. When MS does something like this they lose trust.

Joe, BTW I think you are probably a good guy and that your story is a good one.

You guys who are bashing Intuit and everyone above who have legitimate complaints as "anti Microsoft" must BE Microsoft employees. I work for a large school district and we built our IT support system on Server 2K3, Windows XP, Front page and Office WEB components. The entire system was blown to smithereens when we applied the "critical IE 7 update". Talk about incompatibility! I think we have every right to trash Microsoft especially when their own components DO NOT work out of the box, rarely work together as advertised, need constant patching and updating usually brings the system to a halt. Amen to you Joe for standing up and being counted - this stuff does not work for us either!